Life Interrupted
Lets normalize talking about all things the world has deemed taboo? Do you like wine, coffee, target, tacos & tequila? Ever feel depressed, anxious, or just like you're losing your mind?If yes, then you've come to the right podcast because this is what this podcast is about. We talk about all things real, from motherhood to family, friendships, children, and all the chaos in between. I could go on and on but lets dive right in...This is Life Interrupted.
Life Interrupted
Before I Knew her as MOM
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In this episode of Life Interrupted, I sit down with my mom to talk about the woman she was before motherhood became part of her story.
She became a mother at just 20 years old while growing up in the Bronx, and we talk about her childhood, her family, her dreams, my father, her career, and what it was like learning how to become a mother while she was still becoming herself.
Now that I’m a mother, I see so much of her story differently. This conversation gave me a chance to ask questions I never thought to ask growing up and to look at motherhood, family, sacrifice, growth, and generational perspective through a completely different lens.
This episode is about more than our relationship. It’s about remembering that before our mothers were “Mom,” they were women with their own lives, hopes, mistakes, plans, and stories.
A personal conversation about motherhood, growing up, looking back, and understanding the women who came before us.
Hi everyone and welcome back to Life Interrupted. This episode is a little different for me because today I'm sitting with my mom. I think when we're growing up, we only look at our parents as like mom and dad. We don't look at them as people or people, you know, children that had dreams and things that they wanted to do and aspirations. And so today I'm sitting with my mom who had me at 19, and I was born and raised in the Bronx, and she's from the Bronx. So I have a few questions for her to answer. So you grew up in the Bronx, right? Yes, I did. And you had me at 19.
SPEAKER_02Well, I had your 20. I got pregnant at 19. I had your 20.
SPEAKER_00Okay. So what was it like growing up in the Bronx when you were a little girl? Um good and bad. Both. And he okay, so what was what was the good?
SPEAKER_02Um just you know, having a lot of friends and being able to socialize with different people, growing up in the environment that I grew up in. I grew up, you know, on Leland Avenue, of course, you know that. Um and everybody that I grew up with, we were like one big family.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So we had a lot of, you know, we did a lot of good things and then we did a lot of wrong things.
SPEAKER_00Of course. And what was it like back then, you know, the families? So I know like you lived with grandma and Titi, and you know, before me and Miriam, it was just you three. So what was that like?
SPEAKER_02Um, it was you know, it was good and bad. You you you don't always you don't always agree with your parents, you don't always like your parents. Right. Just like you don't know, just like you don't always agree with your siblings. Um you know, my sister and I, we were, you know, total opposites. Um, my mom was, yeah, I would say kind of strict. Um, you know, she was no joke. Like my grandma, no way. Yeah, your grandma. You know, and you know, you wouldn't, especially me, I was out of the kids, I was the the rebel, the one that always went against the grain. So, you know, even though my sister behaved like she was Miss Goody Two Shoes, she really wasn't. So, you know, in terms of you know, mommy was no, she was no joke. She you you got out of control, out of hand, you get your ass beat, you get grounded, but that wasn't fun.
SPEAKER_00So, what were you like as a teenager?
SPEAKER_01Oh, good bad.
SPEAKER_02I gave my mother a whole lot of headaches. I I I can't I kind of I gave her a run for her money, you know, on many occasions.
SPEAKER_00Is there any particular moment or like thing that you did that sticks out the most?
SPEAKER_02Um yeah, basically me cutting class and you know telling her that I was in class when in school when I wasn't, um and you know, I I didn't go to school for like two months. Oh shit, yeah, and she didn't know until they sent a truant officer to the house.
SPEAKER_00How long did you how what did where did you go?
SPEAKER_02She was working, I was home. Oh shit. I was home sleeping. I was home sleeping, I was watching, you know, I was watching all my children, General Hospital, while life lived, you know, that was that was that was that was our thing, along with my cousin Janette, which she was she was no help because you know, bad influence too. But you know, and and we didn't know until she didn't know until the the truant officer came and you know, I was outside on the corner hanging out with everybody, you know, the way I usually did. And she walked up, she walked up to the corner and was like with her finger, was like, come here right now. And that meant that you were in deep shit and that you were in trouble. Um, you know, she got me by my little, she asked me, So, how was school today? In front of the trend officer, and I was like, it was okay, why? And I'm like, and who is this? And when he introduced himself, I was like, uh oh. And then I turned around, and then I turned around and I see Titi Cookie, and she told Jeanette, bring your ass over here. We were like, we just looked at each other, I was like, oh crap, and you know, got my ass beat all the way down Lila Avenue till I got to the house. Uh I was born, I was grounded for the next two months after that. So, you know, that kind of stuck with me.
SPEAKER_00I can't picture grandma being like that. She wasn't like that with me. I can't picture my grandma being like that, but I came along. No, she wasn't, but she was like that with us. Yeah, well, you guys were her kids. I'm her granddaughter, it's different.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, it's different when it comes to your grandkids.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and you know, she was older when I came a little older when I came around, too. So, but so you lived with Ethi and Grandma, and then you guys grew up on Leland for most of the most of the years. Because you lived in Castle Hill too, right?
SPEAKER_02Prior to uh no, we lived we lived in um before before moving to Leland, we lived on the other side of the Bronx. We lived on on Fordham Rowan University. Oh wow, yeah, that's where we lived prior to. That's where Miriam was born. Oh, okay. That's where we lived prior to moving to Parkchester. We prior to that, we lived in Parkchester, but on the other side of Leland. So we lived on Powell Avenue. We moved from there to Fordham in university, and then we lived in Fordham University. I I don't know, maybe oh my god. I was like what seven, eight when we moved there, and we moved to Leland when I was 12.
SPEAKER_00Oh my god, really? I wow, I thought you were a little older for some reason.
SPEAKER_02No, when we moved to Leland, I was about twelve. And Miriam was she was like four, I think.
SPEAKER_00Oh we were there for a long time.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we I mean we lived on Leland for 30. Well, mommy lived on Leland for like 35 years or something, 30 years, 32 years, something like that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, because no, I think had to have been longer than that because we moved, we moved from Leland when I was 20, 22.
SPEAKER_02Well, I know.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I was 22. Maybe you're right, but I was 22 when we left Leland.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it was like 30 something, 30-something years.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, wow. So, would you call yourself stubborn, quiet? Did you follow the rules?
SPEAKER_02Me follow rules, yeah. No, then yeah, I don't follow, I didn't follow rules then. I always like I said, I I always went against the green. That's why I always got in trouble. That's why I always got my ass beat, and I always got grounded because I never wanted to follow the rules. So I was the one that always broke the rules. You were the rebel, but I but I did it, I did it out in the open. Like, yeah, you know, is it's different when it's different when you have a kid that does things on the low and quietly, and but they do me, I didn't, I just did everything out in the open and didn't care. I was like, okay, well, you know, if I'm gonna get in trouble, I'm gonna get in trouble anyway. So might as well just do it anyway.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, basically, I mean go for it. What's something you appreciate more now as an adult uh from your childhood that you didn't appreciate then?
SPEAKER_02My mom. Um you know you you you uh you take your you take your parents for granted when you're when you're a kid. Um you see everything they do wrong, but you don't see everything they do right. So you you don't realize things, and you don't realize that until you get a lot older, and your parents get older and you actually learn to appreciate them and everything they've done for you and everything they've they've taught you, you know, all the morals they instilled in you. So, you know, and you learn to appreciate your parents more than when you did when you were a kid, you take them for granted because you you never think your parents are gonna get old, you never think your parents are gonna, to you, it's like your parents are always gonna be here forever and ever. You don't think about losing, you don't think about losing a parent.
SPEAKER_00So I don't think that reality sets in until you're a lot older. You know, like uh you put real life, I guess, real life into perspective that this is not forever with this person, you know what I mean? I don't think that I don't think I don't think you realize you think about that when you're younger, because I could say I don't I never thought of grandma getting old. And it's so strange because she's older now, right? And when I see her, I'm like, no way, because in my mind, I never, I never pictured that, right?
SPEAKER_02You look she's gonna be forever young.
SPEAKER_00Right. Like I never, you know, so it's so weird that as you get older and experience things in life, it puts that more into perspective that you know we're not we're not here forever, you know. And yeah, tomorrow's never promised. Yeah. I mean, I think sometimes we only know our mothers as mom, and we forget that, like I said in the beginning, that we forget that they were people prior to, and you know, they make mistakes and you make mistakes along the way, and there's no there's no there's no rule book to this, right? There's no instructions to any of this.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, just like when you have kids, you're not given an instruction book, and you know, you follow the instructions and everything will be fine. No, no, learn, you learn that you learn to be a parent as you go along. So, you know, and like you make mistakes just like everybody else. You you you're human, you're imperfect, and you're flawed, and you're gonna make mistakes as you go along. The the thing with making mistakes is learning from the mistakes so that you don't repeat the same mistakes over and over again.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02You you apply what you've learned so that way the next time around, let's say you have another kid or two kids or three kids, whatever it is, you don't make the same mistakes you made with the first one, especially when you have two when you have kids at a young age, you know, you young, you you you don't know what the hell do you know about having kids? What the what do you know about raising kids? You don't, and you're actually a kid yourself, so you're actually growing up with that kid, yeah, in a sense.
SPEAKER_00So, what was it? What was it? So when you first found out you were pregnant with me, what was your uh initial reaction? Well, you never told me what was that you never told me, you never told me that story. So, what how did you go to the doctor? Did you just like know? Did you take a pregnancy? What was the story and how you found out?
SPEAKER_02Well, no, I mean I knew something was I knew something was wrong because the way that I the way that the way that I felt and the the morning sickness was like instant. So I knew so so I knew something was wrong. So I I got really, really sick one night, and I I went to the ER and I told the doctor that I had I thought I had the flu. And you know, the ER, the ER is gonna run a pregnancy test regardless. Um when he came back, he's like, Yeah, well, you don't have the flu. And I was like, What do you mean? And he's like, Yeah, you didn't have the flu. He's like, You're like nine weeks pregnant. I was like, What?
SPEAKER_01Oh shit, what do you mean?
SPEAKER_02And exactly what I said, oh shit, oh fuck, what am I gonna do now? Like, uh oh, were you scared? Of course I was scared because I was a kid, like, what the hell did I know about having kids? What the hell, you know? Yeah, of course I was scared, and I was scared, you know, to tell my mother.
SPEAKER_00And what was grandma's reaction?
SPEAKER_02Oh, please. Her reaction was like, You ain't having no kids in my house, you better go and get an abortion because you're not having no kids in my house, and she went on every day with the same thing, and she wouldn't talk to me, and she was nasty and rude and just downright nasty. Wow, and it got to a point where I was like, Well, you know what? I'm 19, I'm about to be 20. I'm gonna do what I want to do, and I don't have to do what you want me to do, and you can't force me. So I'm gonna have the baby and end the discussion. And I walked away. And she was pissed off, and she was mad, and she wouldn't talk to me, and she was just downright nasty and rude, and just alienated me, and she was embarrassed and ashamed that I wasn't married, and I was only 19, and I was having a baby, and oh my god, it was like a whole embarrassment thing.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but I feel like people from her generation they see it so different versus like the way things are now, or even like when I had my kids, it was different. The way it's viewed, you know. But yeah, I can see how that can, you know. Yeah, I see how I see that being her reaction for sure.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah, she she she was not very nice about it, she wasn't nice at all. Let's just say that.
SPEAKER_00Wow, well, that hasn't been hard because it's hard. I mean, being pregnant it's hard on its own. So imagine like not having that full support.
SPEAKER_02That it sucks it was, and you know, pregnancy wasn't, you know, being pregnant with you was not the greatest experience. I was a lot 24-7. I was throwing up every hour of every minute of every day. The only thing that that the only thing that actually calmed the morning sickness was coffee. So I used to drink coffee all day. I used to drink coffee all day long.
SPEAKER_00Oh my god.
SPEAKER_02You know, and that made me and that made me, you know, it made me cranky and it made me, you know, just real cranky and yeah, because you're uncomfortable. I I just I just wasn't a very nice person.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I've heard stories about you.
SPEAKER_02I was I was downright nasty. I heard, I heard. Nasty.
SPEAKER_00I'll never forget my godfather told me one story, it was the chocolate cake story, and he bought you the wrong cake and he brought it to the house. And he was like, That's not what the fuck I asked for. Take it back.
SPEAKER_02Well, it wasn't actually, it was him and and and Titi. And I specifically, and I had specifically told her that's not what I asked you for. You're gonna bring me some raisin, something. What since when do you know me to eat raisins? I said, I said chocolate cake. Like, where did you get this from? And I kind of threw it on the floor and I stepped on it, and I just went about my business.
SPEAKER_00You know what's funny? I don't think people really understand when you're pregnant, and and I said this throughout all my pregnancies. The best thing about my pregnancies, even when I was sick, was food. Food tastes so good when you're pregnant, especially when you have a craving for something. It is the best thing in the world to eat. So when you don't get that, or somebody fucks it up, it it ruins your entire mood, your entire day. I've cried because I did not get something that I wanted because I couldn't get it, and I craved for it so bad when I was when I was pregnant with Aria, and I literally cried because I couldn't get it. I forgot what it was, and it was too late to run out and get it or something. I cried. Yeah. Oh my god, that sucks. So did having me put like a wrench in your plans to what you wanted to do and you know, as far as schooling and career, like career-wise?
SPEAKER_02Absolutely. My my my plan was to get my because you know I dropped out of high school because I was stupid, um, but my plan was to get my GD, um, to go to college, and I did that. But then when I wasn't, when I started college, I found that's when I was found out I was pregnant with you, and because the morning sickness was so bad, I I wasn't always able to sit in class and be able to go through the whole class without having to run out. So I had to take a leave, I had to withdraw from classes, take a leave of absence, so that way I'd be able to do it later on. So, you know, I had to wait until you got a little a little older, a little bigger, that I was able to go back to school because then that way I would have mommy's help taking care of you while I was in school. So I I I you know I worked during the day and I went to school at night. So mommy was the one that basically, when you got bigger, she was the one that would pick you up from the babysitters most times, which was Susie. Um and you know, because I wouldn't get home until sometimes till like 10, 11 o'clock.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02But it was it was hard because through a monkey wrench of what I wanted to do because I basically wanted to go to law school, and I put that on hold. And through time, you know, just as time went on and things happened, I kept putting it on hold, putting it on hold, put it on hold, and it just never got done. So having a kid when you're young and you know, and you're inexperienced and you have no clue what the hell you're doing, it is difficult. And even though I have some type of support, but it didn't make it any easier.
SPEAKER_00Did you ever feel like left out? Like, did your friends go off to college and do things and stuff? And did you ever feel left out of that part of what you felt like you should have been doing at that age, at that part of your life, that you wasn't because you had me?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I did. You know, it was and it it was it was hard and difficult at the well at the same time because you know your friends are going off to college and you're stuck. Yeah, yeah, you you you can't go away to college, you can't do the things that you wanted to do because of a decision and a choice that you made. I don't regret my decision, but you know, I think that had I been a little bit older, you know, it would have been a better situation, yeah. Being that being being young and being inexperienced and not, you know, like I said, not knowing, and you know, kids don't come, you know, with with rules, you know, don't come with instructions, follow follow the rules, follow the instructions, and everything will be just fine. That's not the way that works.
SPEAKER_00Was I an easy baby? Like, how was I when I no?
SPEAKER_02You were you were pollocky, you didn't let me sleep. So I think that if I slept two hours a night was a lot. No way that it got to a point that one time I like all you did was cry and cry and cry and cry, no matter what I did. Burped you, fed you, changed you to diaper. I mean, I everything that I could possibly think of to the point where I couldn't handle it anymore. And I took you to mommy and I was like, here. And she was like, and I was like, I can't deal with her. Like, I don't know what to do, what else to do. I've done everything I could I think of, and nothing. She's still screaming. I don't know what else to do here. You take her. And it was weird because the minute that she grabbed you and she kind of cradled you, you quiet down. And I was like, Oh, ain't this some shit? You were screaming for the past three hours. All of a sudden, your grandmother now you're quiet. So I did, you know, you you did that a lot. So I didn't get a I think like in the first year, I really didn't sleep a whole lot.
SPEAKER_00Oh wow. That's rough.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it was. But you know, that's part of being a parent. You gotta roll with the punches and you learn as you go along.
SPEAKER_00And so I want to talk a little bit about Nick, not too much, but I wanted to know what was he around in the beginning at all? Or like during the pregnancy?
SPEAKER_02Not a whole lot. Every now and again. Okay. So he wasn't, he wasn't, you know, he wasn't around a whole lot.
SPEAKER_00He was like, Yeah, I think I I think I have a few pictures like in my baby album with uh with him and with you, but I was already a few months old. Yeah. And then some with like some birthdays, I think like one or two birthdays, I have pictures with him and stuff.
SPEAKER_02He you know, he was present anymore every now and again when you were when you were a baby.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And you know, when you were like maybe two, three around there.
SPEAKER_00How did you guys meet? I don't think you ever, I don't think you ever told me how you guys met.
SPEAKER_02Um actually we met through your godmother. And we back then all the guys that used to hang out with us, and we used to hang out with all the fellas from from Commonwealth and St. Lawrence, um they used to they had a lot of hot rods. So they used to build hot rods. Um and we went to a race one day. And that's how that's how we met. Oh I think it was at Hunt's Point, if I if I'm correct. Oh and he was racing somebody else. Um, and I believe he won the race, and we were all talking, and he's like, Oh, aren't you gonna congratulate me on winning? And I was like, Oh, you need to shut up and get out of my face because you're stupid. That sounds like him. That's how we met.
SPEAKER_00Uh and when you look back at that period of that time in your life, what was what was it like for you before you got pregnant with me and you met him in the time that you guys hung out? What was that like?
SPEAKER_02Um, before, before prior to that, you know, uh it was good. It was I had a boyfriend before him, that I was, which was Tony, that I was with him for years. Um, you know, yeah, and it was it was just being being a regular teenager, you know, going out, having fun, doing teenager things, going to school, hanging out with my friends, which that can't kind of came to a stop once I had you. So, you know.
SPEAKER_00So when you look back at the relationship that you and Nick had, how would if you could describe it in one word or in a sentence, what would that be like? Crack phase.
SPEAKER_02That's what I described, but it was like a crack phase that I went through. And no, I never did drugs like that. No, but that's I describe it as that was like a crack phase. Like I blanked out all of a sudden, and I don't know, lost my damn mind.
SPEAKER_00So well, you got me out of it.
SPEAKER_02So, yeah, that's that that's that's the only good thing that I got out of it. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00No, but you guys are still very good friends now, like you guys maintained friends.
SPEAKER_02No, now we're friends.
SPEAKER_00Now, no, I I know that, but you guys stayed friends. Like, I remember growing up. I mean, he was very in and out, but you guys were cool, not like no, we weren't cool like that.
SPEAKER_02No, we cool like that now, and not you know, to a certain extent, but we were what I mean.
SPEAKER_00Like, me growing up, whenever he came around, I don't ever remember it being toxic or a bad environment. Like you, I don't you guys never presented that to me.
SPEAKER_02Not not well, not not in front of you, but you know, we we had um we had our moments, and you know, he was not allowed to, he was not allowed. Basically, you know, he was on drugs for a period of time, so he was not allowed to see you unless there was an adult present. And it and usually it was your grandmother because I wanted no part of him. I didn't want to see him, I didn't want to talk to him, I didn't want to know anything about him, but I never denied him visitation. Yeah, which was that I remember which was rare when he was around, or whenever he did see you, and the adult present was your grandmother. So she, you know, she supervised the visits, and a lot of the time, the majority of the times I was either working while I was in school, and usually at nights while I was in school, so but it you know, we had our moments where they weren't so very good moments, but you know, I mean, we're we're we're we're cool now, we're friends now, yeah. But I mean, but I mean like it was a whole lot of water under that bridge, and it's been a lot of years, yeah.
SPEAKER_00But I I mean you guys did a pretty well, you did a pretty good job at not showing me any negativity towards him. I don't ever remember that.
SPEAKER_02I don't ever remember there being any toxicity towards each other or um we we we we weren't, I mean we didn't get along along, but I didn't particularly hate him because I under I because I understood um gotta pick up your sister um because I understood the fact that he you know basically was on drugs and I understood that and yeah you know it wasn't something that he did personally to me and in in that manner because you know the drugs had him messed up and he didn't know any better, yeah. So basically, you know, but it wasn't that I hated him or you know, oh he was toxic, it wasn't like that. It's just the whole drug thing was, you know.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but basically did not so going into like when you went back to you know to school and working, was that hard to juggle? I do remember like we spoke about earlier. I remember going to Kipps Bay and grandma picking me up at Kipps Bay and you coming home later because you were, I believe you were in school, so you worked during the day and went to school at night. I do remember that.
SPEAKER_02And what was it like how was that? Yeah, I remember that. It was it it it was hard because you know, I had to take care of you. I was trying to get through school, I was working full-time during the day. Um, so it was it was it was complicated. And it was why are people stupid? I just don't understand. Um it was complicated, you know, taking care of a kid, working full-time, you know, I was young taking care of you, working full-time, going to school full-time. I had to be dependent on on mommy to you know pick you up, you know, from after the after-school program when you got old enough to be in the after school program, you know, or if I had at some point I had Susie picking you up, because she also picked up Sandy's daughter, so you know, and mommy would pick you up, mommy would get home, she will go pick you up, take you home. Yeah. Meanwhile, I got out of work and I went straight to school. So by the time I got actually got home, it was sometimes 11 o'clock at night, and you were already in bed sleeping by the time I made it home.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I remember seeing you in the mornings.
SPEAKER_02Um if I didn't get to see you at night. It becomes different. It it you know, it it's it's hard. It's just it's hard being a single parent. It's hard, period. It's stressful, is you know difficult. Yeah, financially, mentally, emotionally, it's it's hard. And you know, people don't people don't a lot of the times, you know, kids don't understand what our parents go through, especially single parents, and the sacrifices that you know we make or we don't make that is not understood. And you don't realize that till you get older. Like I never understood sacrifices that my mom made, you know. But I could tell you, even being a single mom with two kids, two girls, she she busted her ass working. She always made sure that we have her, we had a roof over our head, we had food on the table, we had clothes on our back, maybe not always what we wanted, but we always had what we needed. And you know, and that kind of made me, you know, I I got a part-time job when I was 14, working in the supermarket, because you know, I wanted sneakers and I wanted this and I wanted that, and those are things that my mom couldn't give me. So I said, okay, I'll get a job and I'll get them things myself. And that's what I did.
SPEAKER_00So you did it. I mean, you finished school and you became a paralegal, and you I remember you busting your ass going to school, like I said, and sometimes I didn't see you at night, but I would see you in the morning. So, what advice would you give someone who becomes a young mother and feels that their goals and their aspirations in life are over? What is something that you would say to them?
SPEAKER_02It's I mean, it seems like your life is over, and to a certain extent, it kind of is, but at the same token, you know, in reality, your life is not over. Like you always, you can never, you can never give up. And you've always got to, you've always had the don't give up hope, and you've always got to strive for your goals and your accomplishments, things that you, goals that you want to reach, accomplishments, accomplishments that you want to meet, hopes and dreams that you have. You can you you can make your dreams come true. You can't make them a reality. It's just, you know, you gotta work at it and you have to strive to get there. It's not, it's never gonna be easy because nothing in life comes easy. Nothing worthwhile in life comes easy. You know, and just because you are, there's a lot of young moms, you know, a lot of girls that have kids, young and well, they even in high school, there were girls that were pregnant that I knew that were friends of mine, and they still made it through high school, they graduated and you know, and still made it to college, even though they had a kid, you know, and were able maybe later on in time because they had to delay it, but they eventually they did, they did do it and they did finish college and and you know accomplish what they wanted to accomplish. Yeah. Nothing comes easy, so you can't, you know, you can't think that your life is over because it's not, and you cannot give up hope because there's always hope.
SPEAKER_00I agree. One thing I really believe now is that motherhood can be a part of your identity, but it's not entirely who you are. You know, we are women too. So when you what was it like for you watching me become a mom?
SPEAKER_02I mean, unfortunately, I wasn't there to actually see it all. Um but I'm I'm proud of you, and I'm proud of the mom that you are. Because you're you're you're the mom that I wasn't to you. That I that I should have that I that I should have been. And I wasn't. Not in every not in every sense. You know, I was young and I made a lot of mistakes. But thankfully, you know, you learn from your experiences. And it's like they say, like, like we say, like us also say, you know, you learn from the hard knocks of life.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_02In order to not repeat the same mistakes, you have to learn from your mistakes as an educational, educational lessons, so that way you don't repeat the same mistakes again. And you know, with that being said, that's why I am the mother to your sister that I am, because I did learn from my mistakes to not repeat the same cycle, to not repeat the same things over again. Granted, don't get me wrong, I've continued to make mistakes because I'm perfect. I'm not perfect, I'm human and I'm imperfect and I'm and I'm flawed. And you know, you're gonna continue to make mistakes, just the mistakes that I've made as a parent to a second child have not been as extreme as the mistakes that I made with you. Yeah. So it it's a good thing. It was a for me, it was a different time then. It taught me a lot of lessons. I learned a lot of hard lessons. Um, and don't get me wrong, you know, I've made mistakes with Michaela too. I mean, I'm not perfect, like I said, I'm not perfect, but I learned I learned a lot, and I grew up a lot. You learn through your experiences and you mature and you grow as a person through your experiences and the mistakes that you make. Oh, absolutely. To not make the same mistakes again, and to become a better person, a better parent. And you know, other the the one thing the one thing that I learned was to be a mother become a woman. Okay, you know, I had you so I used to think of what I mean, is you always have to think of put your kids first, and you gotta put your kids first, and you have to think, okay, I'm a mom. I I can't attend I don't know that you know one of the hardest you know, learning to be a mother before you're a woman is the hardest pill any woman would ever have to swallow. And the lesson, the hardest lesson a woman would ever have to learn. And you know, many women have kids, and you know, they they they have phenomenal parents, they're phenomenal moms, and you know, they put their kids first, and then there's women that only have kids, you know, they think I'm the sufferer, it's all about me, me, me, me, me. Not putting the needs of those kids were not asked, you know, having a child, that kid didn't ask to be born. You made that decision and that choice for them. Yeah. So you have to learn to put your kids first in their needs and and in their best interests ahead of your own. Some women do it, some women don't. And like I said, that's the that's the hardest, the hardest lesson that you will ever learn. Just like in men. You know, most men, not all, but most men, you know, they think they they think like a man first before they think as a parent, as a father. They put their needs ahead of their kids. And not all men, because not all men do that, but most of them do. You know, they don't know how to put the the needs of their children of their kids ahead of their own their personal needs.
SPEAKER_00I think that comes with like when people do that. I think that comes with not being a parent is a selfless thing. Like you have to be, you can't be selfish when you're a parent, especially when your kids are little, but I do feel like not everybody gets to that point where they're not as selfish. They think of, you know, a lot of women. Some women think of, I'm a woman first before I'm a parent, or I'm a man first before I'm a father. And that's not how it goes. There is a balance, though, I feel like there are times where you as a woman, you do come first in certain situations because we do need to take care of ourselves. We need to make sure that we're okay, and we have to pour into our own cups as well. But above all, we are, you know, your parent first. So you have to make sure that you have those, your priorities in line as far as when it's your time, but when it's their time, if that makes any sense.
SPEAKER_02Um yeah, kind of. It kind of makes it kind of makes you know some sense. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I just think that we need to also take care of ourselves sometimes when we, you know, when you're when your kids grow, your kids grow and they make their own lives. And I feel like you we cannot forget ourselves. And I'm not saying, oh, I'm a woman first, and no, not at all. I'm I'm a parent above all, I'm a mom above all, but I do need to leave a little for me. Because when they grow up and they become adults, what do I have? If you're not, if you're married, you have your spouse, you have to pour into that. That's equally important because that's who you're gonna live out life with. If you're by yourself and you don't have anyone, you have to make sure that you're okay with you, you're happy with yourself, you take care of you because when they grow up and make their own lives, that's what you have. So I think that's it's really important for women to remember themselves, to take care of themselves, to also pour into themselves. Because yeah, we are mothers, but that's not entirely who we are in life. We are people too, and I think it's I think it's important to do that. There's so many moms that lose themselves that when their kids grow up, they don't know what to do, they don't know who they are anymore. And it happens, and it happens because I mean, life is crazy, life is hectic, and you get caught up in the hustle and bust of every day taking the kids to school and this and that, you know. But it's very easy to lose yourself. I agree. That's true. You've done a phenomenal job, and even with all the mistakes you made, I mean, we all make mistakes and we all learn from them, you know, and I didn't turn out bad, so you did something right.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, thank god.
SPEAKER_00I'm a little, I'm a little fucked up sometimes, but I'm okay. I survived, I made it, I made it.
SPEAKER_02I mean, you I mean, you know, you you you're you're somewhat like me in a sense.
SPEAKER_00Well, that was so funny that you say that because that was my next question. I was gonna ask you. Is there anything that you see of yourself and me now that I'm an adult and I'm a parent?
SPEAKER_02Your attitude, yeah. Your your your your attitude, your mouth, yeah. That that that's you know my mouth is not that bad. I'm not that bad. I think I've gotten better through all these. Not not now as an adult, because you being a teenager, you gave me a room for my money. Like that's the headaches that I gave my mom, it was the headaches you gave me.
SPEAKER_00I think now that I have a uh that I have a daughter, I remember you, I remember I think it was grandma.
SPEAKER_02You you paid you paid for the shit you do. Yeah, like you did things that I didn't even do. That I was just like, what the hell? Like what just happened? But you know, and yeah, there was many times that you know your grandmother saved you from an ass whooping. Um she did. There was many times that she got in the middle, and there was a couple times that you know, I thought you you get out, you either you get out of the way or you're gonna get hit too. So if I was you, I get out the way. Oh grandma.
SPEAKER_00But you know, she did protect you a lot. She did. She did. She did. She was when I came around, she was a lot softer. Versus what I heard, like how she was with you, how she was with like Miriam. She was a lot softer with me.
SPEAKER_02Um Yeah, I mean, me being pregnant with you, she, you know, she was just a fucking bitch. But yeah. Um, once you came along and she kind of like, oh crap, hold on. Once she came along and you kind of like, you know, softened softened her up a little bit.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Oh my god, grandma was that lady is that's my that's my lady. I used to say for her everything.
SPEAKER_02It kind of changed it kind of changed things a little bit. You know, like she and I say this now, and even now I I even say it to her. I'm like, you know, you talked all that shit, you treated me like crap, you treated me like shit, like I was garbage. And you know, once once you were born and she took one look at you, when I tell you she was the first one that ran. I was like, I was like, look, look at you. She was the first as soon as they took you, they took you to take you to the NICU. She was the first one that ran. She was front and center. I was like, look at you. You talked all that nonsense and look at you now. All of a sudden, my granddaughter, my granddaughter. Seriously, lady. But you know, and she did help in raising you. She was, you know, there. Yeah. So she, you know, she she was part of raising you, and you know, she helped a lot. Even though she even though a lot of the problems came from her interfering, you know, interfering in in my discipline and the way I disciplined you and and the way I did things. And like I said, I would, you know, I wasn't perfect, and I'm not perfect. But you know, a lot of things. A lot of that played into a lot of things.
SPEAKER_00But I think in the disciplining and the interfering was more like parents, like when you have your mom and dad, and they're they they discipline differently, they don't see eye to eye on everything. I think that's more what it was because growing up, all I had was you guys. So you guys were my parents, you know. And I I think that that's what it was. It was more like, well, I'm the softer parent, and and and you're the you're the harder parent, you know, you're the more aggressive, and you're the the one that disciplines, and she was more of the the okay, everybody calm down. You know, she was um too soft. She wasn't, I mean, she was soft for me. I don't I mean, she reprimanded me.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But she I've got in trouble with her sometimes.
SPEAKER_02She she was soft when it when it came to you. Um I think that she was you know, I think that she was a lot softer with Miriam. Um and even then, because she was a lot younger when when you know Miriam was born. Um she was, she she she was, you know, she was soft with you when it came to you too. And she, you know, she protected you a lot. Um especially from my especially from my discipline. Like she interfered a lot.
unknownUh-huh.
SPEAKER_02And sometimes it was good. You know, in a way, in a sense, it was good that she interfered.
unknownUh-huh.
SPEAKER_02In a sense to a certain extent. And then there was other times that, you know, she was there wrong and interfering, and I tell her, you need to mind your business and you need to stay out of it. She's my kid, not yours. Well, you know, grandmothers will be grandmothers. And I think that I think that if I was I think that if I was there uh when your kids were born, if I was there physically when your kids were born, we would probably I would probably have the same type of bond with them. And if I if if I actually lived there, I think that it would be so different because they would see me all the time and I would be around them all the time. And you know, and coming to I mean, I wouldn't interfere in discipline because that I I I wouldn't. Now you go overboard, that's a different story. Yeah, but in terms of you know, I'm always gonna be, I'm always gonna be me, I'm always gonna be, you know, everybody says I'm a bitch. Okay. I'm nasty, I'm rude, okay, I'm all those things. I I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't sit here and pretend to be something that I'm not. Yep, I'm rude, I'm nasty, and I'm a bitch. Yeah, I am, and I own that. Yeah, but that's you know, and like I said, you know, you you're gonna love me, you gotta love me for the way that I am, not for the way you want me to be. You gotta accept my good along with the bad. Just like I accept everybody else. I accept their good with the bad. You know, but having having kids when you're young is is, I mean, back then, I think now is a little di now it's a lot different than it was back then.
SPEAKER_00I think there are more resources now, there's more support, it's not so taboo the way it was back then because I feel like exactly I've had I had this conversation with a friend of mine, and I remember she's she's older than me. So, you know, her generation is a little different than mine. And you know, we talked about like if her kids came home pregnant at 16 and she immediately went to, well, they gotta fucking get a job and get the fuck out. Like, I'm not having that. And for me, I was like, see, I don't think I would react like that. And she was like, Well, what do you mean? And I said, I don't think I would immediately be like, you have to get a job and get the fuck out. I said, I think, you know, mistakes happen and being a teen parent is hard as it is. Making a teen grow up faster than what they should because of a mistake that happened is not going to solve the problem. Because now you tell this team, well, you have to drop out of school or you have to do school and get a job and you have to this and you have to that. Now this person is extremely stressed out. And you know, they're they're on edge, they're anxious, they're trying to figure all these things out at a young age that they can't at 16, you don't know how to be an adult. You you you can't be an adult.
SPEAKER_02Because you're not an adult, right?
SPEAKER_00And you're not gonna think like that. Even even if you have a kid, like yes, you have to, you have more responsibility, but I feel like it puts more stress. And then in turn, what happens? They end up taking it out on the kid. And it's just if you're able to help, like let's say, God forbid, one of my kids, God, I hope not. But I don't think my my initial reaction would be, you have to get a job, you have to this. I think I would step in and help as much as I could to make sure that they can finish school, to make sure that they can have a career so they can be better for their kid. My response wouldn't be, well, you gotta get the fuck out and you gotta this. It would be, this is what we're gonna do. This is what my our plan is gonna be to help you succeed so my grandchildren can be successful. Chivalry's not dead. Back then it wasn't, it wasn't like that. Back then was different. It was very taboo to be pregnant, not married, you know, and as a teen, it was like, no, so now you gotta grow the fuck up. You have to get your own shit. You're an adult, you did this, that's it. It's different now, and there's so many resources now for people.
SPEAKER_02And and you have to remember also, you know, your aunt had a kid even younger than me. Yeah, she was she was way younger than I when I got pregnant with you, I was 19, about to turn 20. Um, she got pregnant at 15. Yeah, so yeah, she got pregnant at 15. She had marriage when she turned 16.
SPEAKER_00I cannot imagine what that would be like.
SPEAKER_02And and it was what that was like, I mean. It it was it was hard, it was real hard because you know, I I was I was little, uh I was what seven, eight. Um and a lot of the times, you know, I took care of Miriam. You know, I I got up, I woke up in the middle of the night, I fed her, I changed the diaper, I bathed her, I dressed her, I fed her. Like, you know, so uh a lot of it was it fell on mommy's responsibility. You know, suddenly now she had three girls. Yeah. And it wasn't, you know, even though she was the granddaughter, but suddenly you have three kids that you have to attend to, that you have to be responsible for, that you gotta pick up the slack on because you know, she's 16. What the hell does she know about having kids? What the hell does she know about taking care of a kid?
SPEAKER_00She didn't think that's one of the things that I pride us, the women in our family, was it was really just the five of us. We never there was no men around. We kind of took care of each other and we um, you know, everybody helped raise their kids, you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_02Everybody was involved, and I think since none of us there was no fathers around, that's why we we we all grew up as alpha females, right?
SPEAKER_00But and this is what I think to myself, I think we became the men that we needed. So I think when in turn, when when men did come around, it was very hard to let them in. Because I can tell you, my first year of marriage was probably one of the most difficult in the beginning because I did not know how to be submissive. I did not know how to let a man lead because I was taught to lead. I was taught to be the man that I did not have growing up. You were all like that.
SPEAKER_02You were taught to be self-sufficient, yeah, self-made, independent, strong-minded, strong character, yes, you know, to be responsible for yourself and to be responsible and always take, you know, like they say, the boom by its horn. Yeah. Um and that's the way we were raised, because we were raised from a single parent, from a single mom who worked, you know, to put food on the table and keep a roof over our head. And, you know, and although a lot of the times I didn't understand a lot of things, now that I'm older, now I see things differently. And now I see the sacrifices that she did make and the things and the things that she did for us. And don't get me wrong, she made her own set of mistakes. And they weren't no little mistakes neither. But now I understand that I'm older and I made my own mistakes, but now I see how and why those mistakes were made. And now I understand it and cop and I can comprehend it better, and I can be more sympathetic towards the mistakes because I've made mistakes of my own, although different from hers, in a sense. But I can see why those mistakes were made, and I can appreciate you know the fact that you grow as a person, which you know, mommy did, you know. So she was always the independent, you know, strong-minded, strong character person.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. You know, I think that's the that's the beauty about being able to look back, and I think as we get older and understanding better and seeing things from someone else's perspective, and and seeing them through your own mistakes as you grow and looking back and appreciating the things that you didn't appreciate before. Because when you're young, you don't think of it like that. As you get older, you go through your own experiences, you make your mistakes and you go through your trials and errors, you see it different.
SPEAKER_02When you're a kid, you don't see you don't see the sacrifices your your your mom or your dad make your parents make. You don't you you see you see it, but you don't see it. You don't really understand it. You don't really understand it or comprehend it until you get older and you have kids of your own. That is when you come to the realization that, wow, this is parenting. Now I understand the mistakes that she made and why she made and how she made those mistakes. Because you make your own, you make your own set of mistakes. Um, and you have to learn from your own mistakes in order to grow as a person and not repeat those same mistakes again. So basically, it it's kind of like a cycle that you're breaking.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think we've all broken our own cycles, you know, and and things before, you know, from grandma's time and even from me growing up and from you growing up. I think we've all broken our own cycles some way or another. And I have to say, for women growing for us women, just being us five of us, we really we figured that shit out. We did, you know, we figured it out.
SPEAKER_02And yeah, you know, but we figured out difficult times, but you know, we we got through it. I think that we back then we stuck more, we stuck, we stuck with each other more then than we do now.
SPEAKER_00Oh, I agree.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, I definitely agree. I agree with that. We were younger and we were, you know, we all lived in the same place, and we all, you know, all we had was each other. So once everybody, you know, once we, you know, everybody went their separate ways, in a sense, you know, it's like everybody made their own lives. Yeah, and like not supportive of each other the way we should be. Um and I and I think in a sense, even back then, even though we stuck by one another and we supported each other even back then, but I think that it was a little bit too much to where you know it interfere in other in in in each other's lives.
SPEAKER_00You know, I think some of us not knowing boundaries, not understanding or comprehending what boundaries really are. Well, that's one thing I don't think that any of us did really understand was boundaries. I don't think I learned how how things need to be when you when you get married and have kids of your own, and that becomes your family. And you know, you the family you grew up with, yeah, they are your family, but they're not your priority. I don't think I understood that until I was already married for a few years. When I really understood and learned to put boundaries with that because there was no boundaries, but again, all we had was each other, all five of us. So we always stuck together. Yeah, and it it was it was hard. It was hard to learn that. And when I when I did set those boundaries, it wasn't easy.
SPEAKER_02See, people look at it, let's say us, we look at it as you know, we're being supportive of one of one of one another and with each other, and you know, we don't I don't think it was never looked at as interfering. Yeah. But in the reality of it, it was interfering. Yeah. Um being supportive of someone and being there for them is knowing boundaries and knowing and knowing where to draw the line and not interfere. And that played a big factor in a lot of things because we you know, it's like we didn't know boundaries. Like we didn't realize we didn't really realize what boundaries were, and we had no boundaries. So even though you're being supportive of one another or you're trying to help one another, a lot of the times those, you know, boundaries were overstepped and it became interference. Yeah, I agree. You know, and and and in a way, you know, I can honestly say, in a way, that's why I I made the decision even to move away and and you know, move to another state and move away. Because there's no there was no way to really to fix it. Yeah, and I can see that you know as long as you stay, as long as you stay in the circle, you can't see things objectively.
SPEAKER_00And that's where the changes come when you step out of something that you've been a part of for so long, and you see it differently on the outside, it changes a lot.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, the same way, like you know, me moving to Florida and you go back to New York and you're like, ew, like the noise, the dirt, the you don't see those things or really realize it when you actually live there and you don't really think about there's a world outside of New York City. A lot of people are stuck. A lot of people are stuck on like New York City is everything. It's not, there's a whole world outside of New York City. You don't real you don't realize you don't realize everything until you move away and you go back and visit, and it's like it's like, oh wow. You know, like wow, I never realized this or that until now. Yeah, it's true. So you know, with family, you don't you don't realize that it's it's interfering in somebody's life and trying to dictate to them what they what they should or should not do. Um until you step out of the circle.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but you know, we all we all did good for ourselves, and I think everybody, I think everybody made their lives, and you know, we um we were pretty strong women, that I will say. And you know, even though you were young when you had me, you did good because I didn't turn out bad. And you did a great job with Michaela, so we made it.
SPEAKER_01But thank you so much.
SPEAKER_02I'd honestly say, you know, you didn't you didn't turn out so bad.
SPEAKER_00I didn't turn out so bad, so that's a win. Thank you so much for coming on with me, talking with me, and telling me your story and what it was like and how wonderful of a baby I was. Before I end this episode, I wanted to take a minute to say something of my own. Sitting across from my mom and hearing her talk about who she was before she was my mom really made me think. As kids, we don't always see our parents as full people. We see mom, we see dad, we see the person who raised us, corrected us, worried about us, and sometimes drove us crazy. We don't always stop to think about the young woman or man they were before they had us. My mom was 20 when she had me. And now that I'm a mom myself, I understand things differently. I understand the mistakes and even the hard, the how hard she was on me for certain things and why she pushed me to be a certain way. And I see it through a different perspective now and understanding a little bit of what it's like being a mom and navigating. I can't imagine being young and being a single parent and navigating all that on your own at such a young age. And, you know, for me, becoming a mom has truly changed the way I view my own childhood and the way I look at my mom. It doesn't, it doesn't mean we've always gotten everything right or that every relationship is perfect. It just means I can look at things now through a different lens with more understanding, more perspective, and a little more grace. And I think that's the part of becoming a mom and reflecting back on your childhood and recognizing what shaped us and realizing that the people who raised us had lives, dreams, struggles, mistakes, and stories long before we even knew them. I'm proud of the woman I am and the mother I've become. And I know so much of that started with the woman who I came from. So, mom, thank you for sitting with me, for sharing pieces of your story, and for letting people meet the woman behind the title, mom. And to everyone listening, maybe take a moment to ask your parents or the people who raised you about who they were before you. You might be surprised on what you learn. And you might be surprised on the better understanding you may have as to why maybe they were so hard on you or were the way they were, and understanding who they were at that time, it may it may give you some peace for unresolved things, or it may make you smile and realize that you had great parents. But take the time until next time. This is life interrupted.